I'm 31 and thinking about getting back in. I would be an E-4. Which will kinda suck cause everyone I went to DINFOS with are E-6 or even 7

Maybe things in uniform have changed since I retired. I believe 2 things will always ring true in the military: (1) rank will always have its priviledges, as it should be, (2) when a general sets a policy, it is rarely if ever seriously questioned. The only orders one is allowed to question or disobey under the UCMJ are those that involve the commission of certain crimes, especially capital crimes. So if the general's policy is to give those above certain ranks the priviledge of no curfew, that will most likely just be the way it is. Everyone who falls under the general's command are expected to support the generals policies. If one hasn't made rank with the pack, then remember that RHIP is another incentive to do your best to get promoted. Peace.

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Turk Quid Pro Quo

Yeah, it has changed since we retired. Obey your last order first is still the smart way to go, but then you have to be a little smart to recognize that. The fact that you do not have to obey an illegal order has not changed. What has changed is that the definition of "Legal order" is now subject to a lot of interpretation. Like certain presidents (that shall go unnamed) have done things in the whitehouse and on duty that would have gotten a military man court martialed and dishonorably discharged. It all boils down to interpretation.
As for General Bell, he has done a lot! I suspect that his plate is overflowing, and perhaps something as controvertial as a curfew, which I suspect will take some time and coordination and cooperation with the host country, may not occur soon, as he is going to be leaving in June. he has set the stage for great progress in Korea, and unless someone else changes that, we will have nothing but improvements in the soldiers' and their families' lives.

There was a time when the "Jump!...How High?" thing was the norm. Then people woke up and realized that to do things smarter and faster they needed to listen to their people. Some of the best ideas come from the bottom up, not the other way around.

Yes rank should have it's privilages...staying out past your bedtime should not be one.

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Dale

"When you question nothing, nothing is all you have!"
http://myspace.com/zerodaydale

-Me at the track 10.9 @ 132 25 shot of nAWZZZ
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Curfew should be done away with, period. Take responsibility for yourself. I didn't have curfew as a teenager, why should we have one now? When I was in Seoul, I felt safer than in most US cities. The quoted reason for curfew, "force protection", is just cover for the real reason which is control. Again, sorry, just bitter.

Although I am old and go to bed early, I think the curfew is the cause of most of the problems. If someone gets off work at 2100 hours, it's how many drinks can I put away before it is time to return to base. Also it encourages people to go to bars in areas where military patrols are not authorize to patrol.

I'm older than Gangster, and probably the General, and I don't know the best answer about curfew.
I am in Seoul, where there are nice places to drink on post. I believe other bases provide similar places. I know some folks who go off post and drink sensibly, and come in, or go to an off post home by midnight. They are not the troublemakers. It is those who are under 21 and the juvenile- minded folks over 21 and genuine alcoholics who cause trouble. I have known, even supervised, some alcoholics, in my time, who were able to hide their problem during working hours, and get blown out of their mind after 4:30. I think the curfew is force protection in a different sense. It protects them from Korean
law, and keeps the problem within the military perview. I believe curfew definitely increases the on post sexual assault problem. And the recruitment of felons and minor criminals does not help, either.
I suspect that curfew will fall on the next USFK Commander to decide.

I'm just curious but how often do you guys see LTs and Captains doing "stupid" things? Or better yet, how often do LTs show up on the police reports compared to privates?

Personally, I think a 22 year old Lieutenant and a 22 year old PFC would act completely different, at least in public. I hate to sound elitist but an officer has a lot more to lose than a private. If you're an enlisted soldier and you see someone who you know is an officer being belligerently drunk and starting fights, you know you have a pretty pathetic officer there. There are certain things that are instilled in us that simply aren't as thoroughly addressed to privates.

Sure, age matters in certain circumstances but in terms of behavior out in public, I think rank would take precedence.

I probably sound like a pretentious ass but that's just my 2 cents

The bottom line is that a 22 year old is a 22 year old, regardless of what shiny bits he or she might wear at work. There are plenty of college educated 22 year old enlisted soldiers too, and your argument falls apart right about there.

They both lack life experience and they both have a greater tendency to make retarded life decisions.

The curfew is dumb and that is the bottom line. Quit playing politics and treat adults like adults. When you do that, the ones that screw up get hammered and the rest of us can carry on without incident.

Pretentious sound like it may fit you, but in reality I think it is just your limited knowledge of the situation we have here. There are PLENTY of stories about Lieutenants, and a few Captains and Majors who have made complete fool of themselves over here; some have paid the price. As a General from Osan once told us, "It is pathetic how some men come over here, lock their morals in a locker, and forget about them until it is time to go back to their families". He was right, of course, but those of us at the Dining-In had to supress a chuckle, as we all knew the relation ship HE had had with his female Aide, a Captain. Boys will be boys, given the right, (or wrong) circumstances, and so will girls. It is difficult for all of us, moral or not, to behave ourselves. I hold that each person is responsible for his/her own behavior, regardless of rank, age or sexuality. Explain the consequences, turn them loose, and let the cards fall where they may.