Unfortunately, no, there's no TLF here at all... you're eligible for around 10 nights, I think (?) at Turumi, if there's space available...and depending on the number of guys coming in at any given time, that's unpredictable. If you go past those 10 days, or Turumi is full, you'll have to be in an offbase hotel, and you're at housing's mercy for reimbursement (and if you've got non-concurrent travel orders and come anyway, I'd say it's highly unlikely that you'd be reimbursed for *any* of your stay here) I'm not sure where they'll put your husband for that time, whether they'll put him in Turumi, and allow him to stay, or if they'll assign him a temporary dorm room somewhere. *G* If it were me, I'd definitely go for the Turumi option. :)

That's one of the reasons that the non-concurrent travel order is in effect, and why, as I said, CS is limited right now, despite the command's desire to have it be more open... if they can't get you into housing right away, there really is nowhere here for you to stay.

If your hubby has to have the lease in hand, you won't need TLF :) You can just move in upon arrival.

I'd wager that part of how long it takes you to get over here after your hubby actually gets here is dependant upon how quickly paperwork gets between bases...that's going to be your challenge from what I've experienced here. Getting paperwork routed is a pain! :) Your hubby shouldn't have any problem finding a place, almost everyone I know has found an apartment here in a few days. I'd just be very specific with your hubby about what you want in a place to live, so he can get a place you'll be happy with :) An August/September arrival should be before the MVV residents are required to move off base, as well.

Also, have you contacted TMO about your household goods yet? You might want to do so soon to find out how much you'll be able to bring over here...you probably won't be able to bring everything, there is a weight limitation even on CS shipments, and I'd recommend being judicious in picking out what goes and what stays, as base housing here is traditionally smaller than it is in other places. You should be able to store what you don't bring at Government Expense, however, so it'll be waiting for you when your time is done here. :)

I wouldn't be too hard on your stateside base right now, for not having all the info.. right now the whole housing situation is so up in the air, no one here can even be certain of what's going on or predict what's going to happen! Everything is just so uncertain, and is really dependant upon the whim of the powers that be who are in negotiation. Imagine how frustrating it is for the MVV families already here who don't know if they'll have to move or not! :)

We've all run into the not being able to get clear info problem, though, that's why this board has become such a great resource for all of us. :)

It sounds like your husband's got a good sponsor, who's on top of things.. would you like the number to call the housing office here at Osan, though? If you're like me, feeling like you're at least doing -something- eases the stress a bit , and going straight to the source eliminates guess work :) If you'd like the number, I'll be happy to get it for you :)

Dee :)

We got an email yesterday (from the powers that be at Osan) that said they would approve concurrent travel if we could secure housing prior to leaving the states. I'm not exactly sure how to do this, we have contacted our sponsor but he is in a dorm and may not be familiar with getting off base housing either. Any suggestions?

You could easily get in contact with a realtor here, Korea Realty, who is often featured here on usfkforums.com is a *great* place, Alex and Michelle are very helpful,and I'm sure you could go through things with them, and they should be able to help you find a place. Emails and webcams can do wonders. Korea Realty also has a very good relationship with the housing office, so far as I can tell, so they're very knowledgeable about the procedures,etc.

As for what the "powers that be" refer to as "securing housing", there's the question of how exactly they define that. That's something that you'll need to find out from the command, or possibly from the housing office. If all they want is for you to be able to say "we found this place, they're holding it for us", etc, then you could probably work with the realtor, though given that you're still a few months out, you might have to pay something out of pocket to hold the apartment that long. Michelle was great about working with us while we were waiting for our 1st months rent to come through (about 3 days or so, normally, and it took us a little longer, thanks to the Thanksgiving holiday), but since, in your case, they'll be holding it a couple of months, I don't think it's unrealistic to ask for some kind of deposit.

If they want a signed lease, complete with inspection done,etc, that makes things considerably more complicated, and again , at this point, my first phone call would be to the housing office. They could tell you what you need to do paperwork wise, whether you can apply for your OHA while you're still out of the country, etc. You may need to give your sponsor a power of attorney to be able to sign things for you until you get here. The housing office also has a list of pre-inspected apartments, so if you contact them and ask about it, they may have something available that will allow you to skip the inspection process.

The normal process for getting off base housing is a very easy one.. 1) You register with the housing office 2) You meet with a realtor,and find a place of your liking 3) You take your lease in to housing and schedule an inspection 4) If your house passes inspection, you can sign your lease then,and there . To start your paperwork for OHA, you'll need to fill out the typical forms (we did this as part of step 1), then give them a copy of your lease, a photocopy of your passport, with your visa and SOFA stamp, and I think a copy of your ID, if you need an advance for your 1st month and deposit, they'll start the paperwork for that, as well.

I'm not sure how that changes with securing housing in advance.

I'd be willing to bet, though, that if you have to pay any deposit to hold the apartment until you get over here, that deposit will likely be non-reimbursable, as if you got reimbursed for it with OHA, while still getting BAH for your current base (or living in base housing there) , finance would be having a field day with you as it would be "double dipping". You'd probably have to pay back either the OHA or the BAH, and no one likes that midmonth, or end of month surprise of a substantially lower paycheck.

I know saying "call the housing office" sounds like a cop out,and doesn't really offer much help as far as giving you concrete answers, but in this case, there are so many variables, so many problems that come up, that that seems like the only responsible answer I can give you. Give them a call,and ask what they would need from you, and about the BAH/OHA thing.

Again, I think your biggest challenge won't be actually *finding* a place, I think your biggest challenge will be in getting all the paperwork processed. Offices here at Osan are notoriously slow, at times, and more than a few papers have been "lost" along the way...someone's always either in-processing, on mid-tour, or out-processing...Unfortunately, as an E-6, you're on the lower end of the CS totem pole...it's much easier for them to make excuses for lost paperwork to and about you, than it is for them to do so with say, an officer, so you may have to really stay on top of things as far as making sure papers are received,etc.

Sorry I can't give you anything more specific! I hope this helps!

Dee :)

Thanks for all your info, you have been very informative. Our sponsor is going to contact the housing office for us and try to find out the specifics of what we need to do. I did call our stateside TMO and found out about our HHG, shipping the car and storage. I don't think it will be a problem for us to downsize to the necessary stuff, it won't be the first time we have lived like that (although a bit more difficult with kids). We were married less than a year when we got orders to Iceland and had not furnished our house yet. We assumed the NEX would be like a BX, and we could find good deals on interim furniture there, we were wrong. There wasn't anything available at that time, and we spent three years there! It was way too expensive to shop on the economy on our salary, so we just made due! (Iceland did by the way remodel and grow, it was nice by the time we left. Go figure, now they closed it.)

I read somewhere that storage and closet space is hard to come by, should I plan on putting clothes racks in our HHG, or can I get what I need there?

Do the kids where uniforms or regular clothes at the elementary? Are there any supplies I should stock up on before we leave or does the BX keep up pretty well? Again, I still have a bit of an Iceland mentality, you just did without there.

Melissa

I flew my dog over in August , we flew him Korean Air Freight direct from ATL , it was an overnight flight , check airlines before you get too disheartened .

Hi, Melissa!

You may be pleasantly surprised, especially if you live off base, at what you find provided for you here! Most off base housing is at least partially furnished,and landlords here are *very* accomodating as to providing things, so you may end up, at least at first, so long as you're in off base housing in far better shape "things-wise" than you may expect . :) The AFRC, aka Family Support has a loan closet that has lots of things as well, to help you out until your household goods get here.

LOL..words of wisdom though..if you get an off base place, and request an oven (most Korean stoves don't have them) make certain to request an *AMERICAN* style stove with an oven.. :) I ended up with a lovely brand new Korean stovetop...with an oven that is smaller than most toaster ovens,and is intended to grill fish. :) Cultural differences, gotta love them! :)

I wouldn't waste your HHG space bringing clothes racks unless you really just *want* to, there are lots of places here, the BX and Emart among them, that have storage and closet options available.

The schools here don't wear uniforms, it's just regular clothes,and one thing that I absolutely love about the "fashions" here is that they're not the same as the US. With your daughter being the same age as my son, she's probably not into the whole peer-conscious fashion thing as an older child would be, but I've noticed that here kids seem to wear the more "normal" kids clothes, jeans, tshirts,etc..with less emphasis on the "trendy".

A word about kids' clothes, Osan's not always the best place to find things for kids, there's not a huge selection or a huge variety of sizes.... Youngsan seems to have a better selection available. Emart has a lot of nice Korean stuff, but they're in Korean sizes..and geared toward the Korean figure.. read: TINY! :) Mail-order, however, works great, just plan for it to take longer to arrive, being that it'll be shipped to an APO address.

As far as winter coats go, since you'll be arriving at a hot part of the year, if you'd rather not ship them, don't worry about it, you can get *fantastic* gore-tex here at a *fraction* of what it costs for winter coats in the U.S.

I wouldn't even think of bringing school supplies, unless there's just some special merchandise featuring a favorite cartoon character your daughter can't live without. You can get everything here, between the BXes here at Osan and Youngsan, as well as Emart and downtown. You can get backpacks here , embroidered with names,and everything, for half the price of what you'd pay back home. The basic 4th grade supply list isn't extensive, nor is there anything really unusual on it, but I would recommend waiting until after your child is assigned to a classroom as well, as some teachers have their own lists of supplies.

The one piece of BX shopping wisdom that I wish someone would have told me before I got here, that I'll pass along to you is this: If you're one of those shoppers that puts purchases off,and waits for items, in hopes that they'll go on sale... DON'T! :) If you see something in the BX and you want it, don't pass go, don't collect 200 bucks, buy that sucker and buy it now while it's hot.. *G* things tend to fly off the shelves,and usually take a longer time to restock, so if it's gone..you could end up waiting a while. :)

The other little piece of learned wisdom I'll pass along, though I'm sure, since you actually *have* a sponsor, you've heard, be sure to bring your hubby's dress blues with you, and have them accessible! :) Our sponsor never contacted us (He didn't even know he was supposed to be sponsoring someone! :) ) so my dh didn't bring his.. we arrived and he was inprocessing during one of the infamous exercises here, so we ended up having to rush around trying to get a dress uniform together at the last minute. What a pain,and expensive,too!

BTW, I haven't asked yet, but if you could PM me with the name of the unit your hubby's going to, I'll see if I know anyone there, and if so, can get you some more contact numbers specifically for you.

I would also recommend contacting the AFRC (Fam. Support), as they have some great resources at their disposal for you,and wow, what a great staff they have there! :)

Dee :)

I have a lot of experience with the dog thing also...and they have always flown us on United to and from the states. I flew my dog over in January as baggage, and will fly him back July 23 as baggage again. We are going to Nellis (Las Vegas) and although United will fly the dog from Seoul, they will not fly to Vegas (way too hot). So, we are flying to San Fransico, and then renting a car and driving the rest of the way. We will be reimbursed for milage, but not the rental. So, you can make it work, but you may have to go through some pain. We have loved having him here, though!

Oh, and non-concurrent travel was in effect last July when my DH came over...I came too non-command sponsored. I had JUST had my first baby 4 weeks prior, and I was determined not to fly here alone, so I came with him. I stayed in Turumi for 14 days with my DH, until he got a dorm. At that time, I moved into our apartment off base (and so did he). He kept the dorm for about a week, until he was approved to move off base, then he just turned his dorm back. It was unconventional, but broke no rules and worked fine. We were out some rent money the first month until we were officially approved "off base" but that was it. You are authorized 30 days in his hotel or dorm room at a time, so you can certainly travel with him, it just may be a bit of a pain living in the hotel for a week or two. He flew United, so I just booked on the same flight, and we just showed up. Everyone told me to wait a month, etc. but I liked coming at the same time, not to mention it helped with the newborn!

The key difference between Razmel's situation, v, and ours is that she is not NCS, as we are... she is command sponsored, and they fall under an entirely different set of regulations than we do.

Actually, the fact that non-command sponsored wives don't fall under the non-concurrent travel policies currently in effect was one reason a friend of mine who is here command sponsored stated to support a comment she made that right now, spouses here without command sponsorship actually have it better than those here with command sponsorship.

A spouse such as Melissa who is now coming over with command sponsorship actually has less leeway with coming over than those of us who come over NCS...and their husbands are actually subject to disciplinary action if they come over at the same time as their husbands, without a waiver on file (and what I've recently been told is that waivers for concurrent travel are being issued now only for key essential positions, otherwise, due to the developments and uncertainty in the housing situation, they're *virtually impossible* to get.)

So, while yes, it may be very possible for a command sponsored spouse to come over concurrently with their husband, against the regs, etc, yes, you could come live in a hotel,etc...but is it necessarily the wisest thing to do? Given the fact that CS spouses fall under the regulations that NCS spouses don't.. I'm not sure I'd want to chance my husband running into the possibility of disciplinary action, especially when the likelihood is that upon his arrival, her husband will probably be able to secure housing within a matter of weeks, at most.

Just as a side note, there is no need now for a NCS spouse to pay *any* money out of pocket for a first months rent, unless there are extinuating circumstances...whether or not your husband has been approved to live off base is irrelevant, the entitlement to OHA is technically the *spouse's* benefit, and can be secured from your first day of arrival in country.

You are also entitled to 30 days in the dorms, with proper paperwork on file, including your suitemate's signature... however, do be aware that under current finance regs, you are only allowed 30 days max without a physical address before you lose your entitlement to BAH during the transitional period. Several of us encountered difficulties with finance at one point when they tried to take our BAH for the time period we were staying in hotels/dorms,etc..the time *before* our OHA took effect... but after taking the problem up the chain in finance, the 30 day reg was discovered and the money that was taken to us was returned. (short lil chick, I know, encountered the same problem as we had with that, and I've heard of one or two other families who ran into the same situation,and appealed, with the same results).

As far as a hotel room goes, however, it's my understanding that a spouse's stay in a hotel room is non-reimbursable.. your AD spouse can be reimbursed for his time in a hotel room *if he arrives on station at a time when the housing office is closed and/or if there are no vacancies available in the dorms when he checks in (and AD members, unless given special dispensation are expected to check in the first duty day after they arrive)*

Of late, however, there haven't been any real problems with a lack of room in the dorms, guys are getting in on their initial check in,and housing is very picky about not paying for days that they haven't authorized, so if you choose to stay in a hotel room, and not the dorms, you may be paying out of your own pocket.

And given the fact that virtually all command billets are non-concurrent travel status, I highly doubt that any time spent in a hotel room while you're waiting for your apartment, *unless your lease is already on file and approved* will be reimbursed.. I freely admit that that is merely conjecture, that's not die hard fast fact, but it is my opinion, given my experience and knowledge of how strictly the housing office holds to reimbursement for hotel rooms.

BTW, at the last town hall meeting, the date of July 15 was mentioned as a line in the sand date for the current situation with Mustang Valley...so hopefully we'll have some news then, for those who are here command sponsored. I know there are at least 35-40 families that are hanging on to the edge of their seats to know what's going to happen.


Hope this kind of clarifies any differences in the NCS/CS thing. :)

Dee :)